I need grammar practice!

[Pacifica]

For example: nihil cibi = literally "nothing of food" ---> "not a bit of food", "no food".

 

[Lysandra]

I see what you mean. I'm just trying to make sense of 'some substance' in relation to the next part. My initial understanding was that Augustine didn't think something was worthwhile unless he could see it with his own eyes.

 

[Pacifica]

My initial understanding was that Augustine didn't think something was worthwhile unless he could see it with his own eyes.

You were clearly (and understandably) influenced in that erroneous interpretation by the superficial resemblance of substantiae to the English idiom "of substance" meaning "of importance".

 

[AoM]

Small correction: you can't tell by scansion – the last syllable of a line is always lenghthened by virtue of being at the end of the line, even if it's not properly long. So it could be nominative and the last syllable would still be lenghtened.

So even if the last foot is a trochee, the last syllable will lengthen anyway?

I guess I'm getting confused between anceps and brevis in longo.

 

[Lysandra]

Still, I'm a bit lost after the initial part ...

Now my immoral and devious adolescence was dead, and I was going into young adulthood, as much older in age as more wicked in vanity, I who thought some substance except such that I could not as it is accustomed to seem through those eyes.

 

[Dantius]

qui cogitare aliquid substantiae nisi tale non poteram, quale per hos oculos videri solet.

1. "I who thought": parse cogitare. Upon what word does it depend?
2. tale...quale per hos oculos videri solet should be taken closely together: "such as is accustomed..."; don't put anything else between tale and quale in your translation.
3. Here, videri has the literal meaning, not "to seem".

See if these can help.

 

[Dantius]

So even if the last foot is a trochee, the last syllable will lengthen anyway?

I guess I'm getting confused between anceps and brevis in longo.

I'm no expert on this kind of thing either; I think I've read that the last syllable of a line is lengthened rather than just being an anceps (where the meter will accept either a short or a long syllable), but I'm not sure.

 

[Lysandra]

Now my immoral and devious adolescence was dead, and I was going into young adulthood, as much older in age as more wicked in vanity, I who could not imagine some substance except such as is accustomed to be seen through those eyes.

*I did have 'to be seen' instead of 'to seem' originally.

 

[Pacifica]

as much older in age as more wicked in vanity

I realize that bit is awkward to translate literally in English, but I think you may be understanding it backwards. As a test, could you translate this bit that I've taken out of the text and turned into a complete sentence?

Quanto aetate maior, tanto vanitate turpior fiebam.

I who could not imagine some substance except such as is accustomed to be seen through those eyes.

That is now correct except for a detail: "those".

 

[AoM]

I'm no expert on this kind of thing either; I think I've read that the last syllable of a line is lengthened rather than just being an anceps (where the meter will accept either a short or a long syllable), but I'm not sure.

Found this paper. I'll read it eventually to see if it elucidates anything.

 

[Lysandra]

That is now correct except for a detail: "those".

*these

 

[Pacifica]

Yes.

 

[Lysandra]

Idiomatic:
Now my immoral and devious adolescence passed, and I was moving into young adulthood, becoming more wicked in vanity as I grew older in age, I who could not imagine the existence of something beyond what I could see through these eyes.

 

[Pacifica]

Good.

 

[Pacifica]

Aeneid. Context: Venus (Aeneas's mother) appears to Aeneas in human form and speaks to him; then Aeneas replies:

'Nulla tuarum audita mihi neque visa sororum—
O quam te memorem, virgo? Namque haud tibi voltus
mortalis, nec vox hominem sonat: O, dea certe—
an Phoebi soror? an nympharum sanguinis una?—
sis felix, nostrumque leves, quaecumque, laborem,
et, quo sub caelo tandem, quibus orbis in oris
iactemur, doceas. Ignari hominumque locorumque
erramus, vento huc vastis et fluctibus acti:
multa tibi ante aras nostra cadet hostia dextra.'

1) Parse the whole first line.
2) What is memorem?
3) Why are sis, leves, iactemur and doceas in the subjunctive?
4) What are the genitives hominuque locorumque doing?
5) Among the words multa, nostra, hostia and dextra, what is agreeing with what?

Then, do the usual twofold translation exercise.

 

[Dantius]

4) What are the genitives hominuque

This looks more like a rare alternate fouth declension ablative form rather than a genitive

 

[Dantius]

iactemur, doceas. Ignari hominumque locorumque
erramus, vento huc vastis et fluctibus acti:

A few more questions:
6. Scan these two lines.
7. Why am I asking you to scan these lines in particular?

 

[Lysandra]

As a test, could you translate this bit that I've taken out of the text and turned into a complete sentence?

Quanto aetate maior, tanto vanitate turpior fiebam.

I realised I never saw this question. It's a bit late now, but I think the translation is The older in age, the more wicked in vanity I became.

 

[Dantius]

Yes.

 

[Lysandra]

Aeneid. Context: Venus (Aeneas's mother) appears to Aeneas in human form and speaks to him; then Aeneas replies:

'Nulla tuarum audita mihi neque visa sororum—
O quam te memorem, virgo? Namque haud tibi voltus
mortalis, nec vox hominem sonat: O, dea certe—
an Phoebi soror? an nympharum sanguinis una?—
sis felix, nostrumque leves, quaecumque, laborem,
et, quo sub caelo tandem, quibus orbis in oris
iactemur, doceas. Ignari hominumque locorumque
erramus, vento huc vastis et fluctibus acti:
multa tibi ante aras nostra cadet hostia dextra.'

1) Parse the whole first line.
2) What is memorem?
3) Why are sis, leves, iactemur and doceas in the subjunctive?
4) What are the genitives hominuque locorumque doing?
5) Among the words multa, nostra, hostia and dextra, what is agreeing with what?

1) nulla is a nom. sg. fem. pronoun ( Godmy ), audita and uisa are nom. sg. fem. perf. pass. participles (with an implied ‘est’), sororum is a gen. pl. noun, tuarum is a gen. pl. pronoun modifying sororum, mihi is dat. sg. (dat. of agent)
2) verb
3) jussive subjunctives
4) ‘ignari’ takes a genitive (ignorant of …)
5) If my scansion was correct, ‘multa’ agrees with ‘hostia’ and ‘nostra’ with ‘dextra’.