Choosing the things that appear.
The men are wailing at others' feet.Though that makes it a bit ambiguous: are the men wailing at their own feet, or someone else?
"Your" is used generically.
This is the beginning, my friends, let us celebrate with arousing ladies
- Thread starter AdvocatusDiaboli
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"Your" is used generically.
Two more questions, AdvocatusDiaboli :
1) Is "arousing (ladies)" meant to mean "sexually arousing", or just generally "delightful/stimulating"?
2) Is "your" in "your feet" singular or plural (are you talking to one person or more than one?)
1) Is "arousing (ladies)" meant to mean "sexually arousing", or just generally "delightful/stimulating"?
2) Is "your" in "your feet" singular or plural (are you talking to one person or more than one?)
Also, can you explain a bit more what you mean by "In Hythnia, what appears is precisely what is made to appear"? Who is making the thing(s) appear? Is it by some sort of magic/science or just people acting deceptively? Do you mean more "what things appear are precisely those things that are made (chosen) to appear", or "how things (the general scene/circumstances) appear are precisely how they are made (chosen) to appear"?
So no need of tuos or vestros.
Sexually arousing, it was implied by the "well-hung gents" part that proceeded it. As I said, your is used generically. Pacifica says that due to this, there's no need of "tuos" or "vestros".
In Hythnia, you only see things if they're allowed to appear.
It's neutral, such and such things are chosen to appear, nothing is forced to appear nor is anything masked or otherwise doctored, rather, Hythnia is so unique in its operations and circumstances that it's best to appreciate and understand Hythnia as a Hythnian would or risk deceiving yourself. What appears is precisely what the circumstances allow to appear. A boy is not an innocent non-combatant by default nor is a man necessarily hostile.
In Hythnia, all things appear as they are but not all things(as seen elsewhere) appear in Hythnia. In Hythnia, all things that are made to appear, appear, to understand Hythnia, examine it, as it appears as this will tell you what has been chosen to appear as allowed for by the circumstances and you'll in this way understand the circumstances, the people and their understanding of the circumstances. The author also warns that Hythnia, as it isn't at all like anywhere else, is unintentionally deceptive and that great caution should be taken not to maintain an undercurrent of suspicion regarding their supposed disingenuity. He further implies that due to this likely error, it's a potentially dangerous place. It's philosophical language.
Putting everything together, I might suggest the following. / means two options and parentheses mean the word is optional.
Hoc, amici, initium est. Magnificis conviviis/dapibus una cum feminis quae pruriginem incitent et viris bene mentulatis comissemur.
Quid? Non approbant Ivernii? Esto. Oderint, dum ament.
Hythniae/In Hythnia* viri ad pedes (cuiusque) vagiunt, pueri autem celatos gladios ex vestimentis stringunt. Hythniae/In Hythnia* id ipsum apparet quod apparere sinitur.
*Hythniae is to be used if Hythnia is a city (or a small island); in Hythnia if it's a country.
Hoc, amici, initium est. Magnificis conviviis/dapibus una cum feminis quae pruriginem incitent et viris bene mentulatis comissemur.
Quid? Non approbant Ivernii? Esto. Oderint, dum ament.
Hythniae/In Hythnia* viri ad pedes (cuiusque) vagiunt, pueri autem celatos gladios ex vestimentis stringunt. Hythniae/In Hythnia* id ipsum apparet quod apparere sinitur.
*Hythniae is to be used if Hythnia is a city (or a small island); in Hythnia if it's a country.
Oh wait, there's something that she changed...
This doesn't quite keep the sense of "while"; the two actions could be happening at different times and in different places.
After AdvocatusDiaboli's explanation, I take this "while" to be contrastive: In Hythnia, men will wail at your feet (a behavior you would expect from children) whereas boys will draw swords (a behavior you would expect from men).
Indeed, that's how I take it after reading the explanations.
Hmmm. I actually understood the two actions as happening simultaneously: the men are wailing (to distract you & make you think they want your help, or whatever) while the boys are drawing concealed swords.
I guess AdvocatusDiaboli will need to tell us. AdvocatusDiaboli, are these two things (necessarily) happening at the same time?
I guess AdvocatusDiaboli will need to tell us. AdvocatusDiaboli, are these two things (necessarily) happening at the same time?
Autem doesn't preclude the possibility that they may be happening at the same time.
It's contrastive. Thank you both for your help.
Also, ladies and gents is used in a sense connoting nobility and/or rank rather than "men and women" generally as it's used today
Also, ladies and gents is used in a sense connoting nobility and/or rank rather than "men and women" generally as it's used today
In that case, you can replace feminis and viris with dominabus and dominis, but that's not a classical Latin usage (it's more like medieval or perhaps even later).
There's no true equivalents in classical Latin, but adding the word nobilibus before feminis and viris would convey the idea that they are noble women and men.
There's no true equivalents in classical Latin, but adding the word nobilibus before feminis and viris would convey the idea that they are noble women and men.
I think I know what you mean by this, but let me be sure. Which of the following two is the case?
(1) The "men wailing at your feet" and "boys drawing hidden swords" are part of the same event; one can't occur without the other.
(2) The "men wailing at your feet" and "boys drawing hidden swords" are not connected; they can happen at different times, in different places, etc. (or at the same time and place; both are possible).
The two are not inextricably bpund together, or at all.
Having loved, let them hate. Having hated, let them love. In all things there are contrasts and all contrasts ebb from the same well. Being impassioned, they have loathed, being impassioned, they will love. Showing, they will conceal and concealing, they will show.
How about this?
How about this?