1589 A.D. House Inscription

By Mayes, in 'Latin to English Translation', Jun 24, 2019.

  1. Mayes New Member

    christe tuere domum natos defende parentis
    ne noceant ignes furta rapina noti
    munus id est domini viti terraeque fodinis
    qui bene dixit opus protegat ille suum
  2. Laurentius Weebus Maximus

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Antium
    I wonder, could it be doli or something instead of noti? I don't really get what that word is supposed to mean there.
  3. Mayes New Member

    This is the original text. I might have made some mistakes in transcribing it. UNADJUSTEDNONRAW_thumb_2bc.jpg
    Issacus Divus likes this.
  4. Bitmap Civis Illustris

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Cygnea, Gena
    Oh nice, elegiac couplets!

    noti (short o) probably means "winds".
    Laurentius likes this.
  5. Laurentius Weebus Maximus

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Antium
    Oh I think you are right! Then I guess it should probably be something like this:

    Christ, protect the house, defend the children
    so that fires, robberis, plundering and winds won't do any harm
    It is duty of the Lord, may he who blessed the vine and the furrows
    of the ground protect his work.

    Not sure if the author intended the relative qui to go with Lord or to be standalone as I have translated but I think both should be correct, even if I find the latter may be more likely.
  6. Etaoin Shrdlu Civis Illustris

    • Civis Illustris
  7. Cinefactus Censor

    • Censor
    Location:
    litore aureo
    So you are taking parentis as genitive rather than acc pl?
    Laurentius likes this.
  8. Bitmap Civis Illustris

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Cygnea, Gena

    I also took it as a genitive ... I assume if you take it as an accusative plural you consider it to be some kind of asyndeton?
  9. Cinefactus Censor

    • Censor
    Location:
    litore aureo
    That was how I took it. I am sure you are right, but why only the children of a single parent? Parentum would also scan.
  10. Laurentius Weebus Maximus

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Antium
    I just thought it was a pleonasm but you may be right, it happens in the following line too.
    I had found it before making an attempt but it looked weird. :confused:
  11. Bitmap Civis Illustris

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Cygnea, Gena

    Well, an asyndeton is a bit unusual with only 2 components, though not completely unheard of.
    In the genitive reading I'd either take parentis as "of the father" as the head of the family or I'd even take it as the one who built the house and natos as his descendants (over many generations).
    Cinefactus and Laurentius like this.
  12. syntaxianus Civis Illustris

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Massachusetts, USA
    Parentîs could also be a participle meaning "obeying, obedient."

    Pareo :: 2. Transf. a. To obey, be obedient to; to submit to, comply with (the class. signif. of the word; syn.: oboedio, obsequor, obtempero): parere, obedire
  13. Bitmap Civis Illustris

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Cygnea, Gena

    I can't come from that word because the a in pareo is long.
  14. syntaxianus Civis Illustris

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Massachusetts, USA
    Is there a chance parentis = parentibus? "Defend the children for their parents."

    Cf. queis = quibus

    Also : "In the authors of the 10th and 11th cent. the change of the ablative plural -ibus to -is and vice-versa is common." Page 203, note 488: Moriuht: A Norman Latin Poem from the Early Eleventh Century by Garnerius (Rothomagensis.), Warner (of Rouen), Garnier de Rouen, Warner of Rouen, Pontifical Institute of Mediaeval Studies, 1995.

    If it can happen for the ablative in an earlier era it may be able to happen for the dative at a later time, especially for scanning purposes in poetry.
  15. Pacifica grammaticissima

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Belgium
    It seems unlikely to me. People in the Renaissance rather followed classical Latin rules.
    Bitmap likes this.
  16. Issacus Divus Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Gæmleflodland
    I wish they hadn't, but that's a bit off topic.

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