1. Stenchburg New Member

    hello everyone.

    I found this really beautiful chant on youtube.

    they list the latin lyrics, but google translate mangled them in the english conversion.

    I was hoping someone here might be able to translate them. Im making a comic book, and would love to include the latin and english text.

    here is the latin text.

    Da pacem, Domine, in diebus nostris
    Quia non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi tu Deus noster.

    1. Fiat pax in virtute tua: et abundantia in turribus tuis.

    Da pacem, Domine, in diebus nostris
    Quia non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi tu Deus noster.

    2. Propter fratres meos et proximos meos loquebar pacem de te:

    Da pacem, Domine, in diebus nostris
    Quia non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi tu Deus noster.

    3. Propter domum Domini Dei nostri quaesivi bona tibi.

    Da pacem, Domine, in diebus nostris
    Quia non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi tu Deus noster.

    4. Rogate quae ad pacem sunt Jerusalem:et abundantia diligentibus te.

    Da pacem, Domine, in diebus nostris
    Quia non est alius
    Qui pugnet pro nobis
    Nisi tu Deus noster.

    5. Gloria Patri et Filio et Spiritui Sancto, sicut erat in principio et nunc et semper, et in saecula saeculorum. Amen
  2. Cinefactus Censor

    litore aureo
    Give peace, O Lord, in our time
    Because there is no-one else
    Who will fight for us
    If not you our God

    The following are from Psalm 122
    1. Let there be peace in your strength, and abundance in your towers (The KGV has Peace be within thy walls, and prosperity within thy palaces)
    2. I wish you peace for the sake of my brothers and my family
    3. I have sought good for you because of the house of the Lord God
    4. Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee
    5. Glory to the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, just as it was in the beginning, and now and always, and forever. Amen.
  3. Pacifica grammaticissima

    Rather "would"... detail I suppose.
  4. Stenchburg New Member

    wow thanks so much! I really appreciate you guys taking the time and translating that for me.
  5. Pacifica grammaticissima

    Nikolaos: You deleted your post...

    Actually maybe the best translation for non est alius qui pugnet pro nobis would be "there is no one else to fight for us"; it's a relative clause of purpose, or characteristic, or a mix of the two, whatever you call it.
    I'm having trouble getting what's going on in this line. If we go a little more literally:

    Ask (pl.) for what is for the peace of Jerusalem: and - then we suddenly have abudantia in nom. with what, sit/erit implied? And what is that sudden change of addressee within one line?

    "Ye, ask for what is for the peace of Jerusalem, and (let there be?) prosperity to those who love thee", how does that make sense?
    I also find that weird. Lit. "I was speaking about peace about you/from you?" Is that a special medieval meaning of loquor?
  6. Aurifex Aedilis

    This looks to mean:
    "Pray for those things that are (conducive) to the peace of Jerusalem, and for abundance (lit. things abounding) for those who love you."
  7. Pacifica grammaticissima

    Ah, I get abudantia better, I hadn't thought about the participle.

    But what about the plural "you" in the first part, and singular in the second? (I considered it could be roga te but it would be weird too, maybe. Ask yourself for those things... Not impossible.)
  8. Aurifex Aedilis

    Looking at a range of translations it looks like this is a vexed passage. Many translations put the bit beginning et abundantia in quotation marks.

    e.g. The New King James Version:
    Pray for the peace of Jerusalem:
    “May they prosper who love you.
    Peace be within your walls,
    Prosperity within your palaces.”

    The Wyclif Bible explains things best:
    Pray ye those things, that be to the peace of Jerusalem; and abundance be to them that love thee. (Pray ye for the peace of Jerusalem; and say, May those who love thee prosper, or have great abundance.)

    I'd be hesitant now to say whether abundantia is 1st decl. noun or neuter pl. participle. Judging by the Wyclif Bible we are meant to assume the former and supply fiat. But if it is quoting direct speech where does et fit in? Are we meant to supply a word for "say" as well? It all seems a bit awkward.
    Pacis puella likes this.
  9. Nikolaos schmikolaos

    It was past my bedtime :p

    I couldn't decide whether "will" or "would" sounded better, but "will" does sound better to me when I (ostensibly) have my wits about me.
  10. Roma Onmia Vincit New Member

    In order to make sense of this song you have to look at all of psalm 122
    The pilgrims/ crusaders/ Templars ( however you want to call them) are referencing this psalm. The notes in parentheses are mine

    I / was glad when they said to me,
    “Let us go to the house of the Lord!” (the Temple which was located in Jerusalem)
    Our feet have been standing
    within your gates, O Jerusalem!

    ( I skipped verses 3, 4 and 5)
    In verses 6 and 7 the psalmist/ pilgrim is addressing the city of Jerusalem directly, not his fellow travelers, that explains the change from 1st to 3rd person

    6 ( You who come to Jerusalem) Pray for the peace of Jerusalem!
    “May they be secure who love you! ( oh Jerusalem) (i.e. may those who love you find safety in you oh Jerusalem)
    7 (Let) Peace be ( found) within your walls ( oh Jerusalem)
    and (let) security ( be found) within your towers!”
    8 For my brothers and companions' sake
    I will say, (Let)“Peace be within you!”
    9 For the sake of the house of the Lord our God,
    I will seek your good. ( the good of Jerusalem)

    Psalms were also supposed to be sung so it is possible that certain words were left out for the melody's sake or for rhythmic reasons, the same applies to the Templars' song.

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