eum ducem belli poposcit

By itaque, in 'Latin Beginners', Aug 12, 2019.

  1. itaque Member

    I am trying to translate these sentences from the Oxford Latin Course, which refer to Octavian:
    Here is my attempted translation:
    All Italy swore allegience to him and demanded that he (be) the leader of the war. The senators who favored Antony, having exited Rome, fled to Antony.... But Octavian, who was administrating Italy (by way of) having left behind Maecenas, set out for Brindisi.

    In addition to wondering if my translation is correct, I have these questions:
    • Is my insertion of "(be)" in the first sentence correct? Why was "esse/fuisse/fore" not included?
    • What is the purpose of "ei" in the second sentence?
    • Why is "administraret" in the subjunctive mood?
  2. Bitmap Civis Illustris

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Cygnea, Gena
    Yes, your translation works. esse can often be left out (ellipsis).
    It's just a demonstrative pronoun that prepares the subsequent relative clause.
    The qui in that relative clause refers to Maecenas. The subjunctive means that it has an additional nuance in meaning, in this case it means that it is to be taken as a final clause. qui Italiam administraret = ut (Maecenas) Italiam administraret.
    Gregorius Textor likes this.
  3. Dantius Homo Sapiens

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    in orbe lacteo
    I wouldn't even say esse is implied, you can just translate it "demanded him as a leader of the war" (I don't think posco commonly takes acc + inf)


    I don't know what terminology the Oxford Latin Course uses, but I say "purpose clause" rather than "final clause"
    Pacifica likes this.
  4. Pacifica grammaticissima

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Belgium
    Yeah, there's no ellipsis here.
    I've seen both terms.

    I mean in general; I don't know about the Oxford Latin Course.
  5. Dantius Homo Sapiens

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    in orbe lacteo
    Yes, I've seen both terms too. But back when I was first learning about those subjunctive clauses, if someone had said "final clause", I would've had no idea what they were talking about, so I just wanted to make sure both terms were provided since I don't know which itaque is used to.
  6. Bitmap Civis Illustris

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Cygnea, Gena

    Sorry, somehow I keep forgetting that English has a completely different terminology. When I say 'final', I mean 'purpose' of course.
  7. Dantius Homo Sapiens

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    in orbe lacteo
    A&G says "final", I think, so at least it's totally fine in slightly older English
  8. Gregorius Textor Active Member

    Location:
    Ohio, midwestern U.S.A.
    I, too, was unfamiliar with the term "final clause", but I understood it by analogy with Aristotle's notion of "final cause", i.e., the purpose or reason for a thing to be. In fact I was wondering at first if Bitmap had omitted the "l" as a typo. :)
    Pacifica likes this.
  9. Pacifica grammaticissima

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Belgium
    You mean added.
    Gregorius Textor likes this.
  10. Bitmap Civis Illustris

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Cygnea, Gena
    Aristotle omitted the l.
    Gregorius Textor likes this.
  11. Gregorius Textor Active Member

    Location:
    Ohio, midwestern U.S.A.
    Yes, of course.

    If only I had written "he had omitted," I could claim that I was referring to Aristotle instead of Bitmap.:eek:
  12. Pacifica grammaticissima

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Belgium
    More likely to Aristotle's English translator.
    Gregorius Textor likes this.

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