I'll either find a way or make one

By Gsedge1, in 'English to Latin Translation', Dec 11, 2010.

  1. Gsedge1 New Member

    Hi,

    I've been reading this site and found that I'll either find a way or make one translates to aut viam inveniam aut faciam

    Now, I've been told that:-

    1 - I can drop the 1st Aut to make it viam inveniam aut faciam?
    2 - I've been told that it should be in capital letters with serif and that Latin does not have a j or a u, i and v being used which would make it VIAM INVENIAM AVT FACIAM?
    3 - What font should this be written in - I've been given an example in Linotype Palatino font which looks good?

    Thanks in advance for any help, it's very much appreciated.

    Regards
    Gary
  2. Adamas New Member

    Re: Translation help

    Yes. It's less emphatic, like 'I'll find a way or make one' rather than 'I'll either find a way or I'll make one.'

    It doesn't need to be in capital letters, nor does it need serif, unless you're trying to imitate a public inscription. If you are, then your version is right; you could also add interpuncts between the words. But Latin as we know it has been around for some 3500 years; depending on what period and style you're imitating, there are hundreds of options for font. If you were imitating Roman handwriting, for example, you could use minuscule letters: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_cursive

    Sure. It's a font based on the style of the Italian Renaissance. If you're imitating Roman majuscule, you'll want a font that looks more like this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_square_capitals
  3. Gsedge1 New Member

    Re: Translation help

    Thanks for the reply.

    So to clarify (sorry if this is wrong):-

    viam inveniam aut faciam is more like I'll find a way or make one and aut viam inveniam aut faciam is closer to what I actually want I'll either find a way or I'll make one

    Oh, and what about what I've been told about there being no 'U' i.e. avt viam inveniam avt faciam as this has thrown me a little?
  4. Nikolaos schmikolaos

    • Censor
    Re: Translation help

    Very few people replace the lower-case U with V... in fact, I've seen more people replace the V with U, as in saluus as opposed to salvvs for salvus.

    In truth, they are really the same letter - rules exist for using both letters at the same time, but there is no problem of using only one or the other. Take the letter A, for example - the lower-case form (a) looks completely different when typed from when it is written (same goes for the lower-case G). The difference is only stylistic - we all know what it means.
  5. Gsedge1 New Member

    Re: Translation help

    God, this is confusing.

    So, as this isn't a public inscription (please correct me if it can be as I like it in capitals) then it should be lower case and I can keep the 'u' to make it aut viam inveniam aut faciam?

    Please note that this is for a tattoo so I need to get this right 1st time for obvious reasons.......

    Oh, and thanks again for any help.
  6. Cinefactus Censor

    • Censor
    Location:
    litore aureo
  7. Adamas New Member

    Re: Translation help

    There are many wrong ways to write Latin, but there isn't one singular right way to write Latin. It depends, again, on what period and style you want to imitate, and what you're using the phrase for. Mimic the Imperial style of Rome to the same extent you'd mimic the fonts and orthography of Benjamin Franklin in the process of trying to invent a phrase modeled after 18th-century American English. How much would you care about historical accuracy if you were getting 'We the People' tattooed on your chest? That should give you a rough idea of your own priorities.

    If you want to use minuscule, these are the two best options:

    aut viam inveniam aut faciam

    or

    aut uiam inueniam aut faciam

    The former is what a modern or medieval reader would expect. The latter is closer to what an ancient Roman would expect and is common among classicists (i.e., people studying Latin academically these days), but a non-classicist will have more trouble reading it.

    Since U/u and V/v were originally the same letter, one general rule is to use V when you capitalize and u when you don't capitalize (V/u). You'll also sometimes see U capitalized, but only if it's a vowel (as in AUT); and you'll quite often see v uncapitalized, but only if it's a consonant (as in viam, inveniam). So, for example, here are four correct ways to write the same word: servus, seruus, SERVUS, SERVVS. All are pretty common, depending on what circles you travel.

    If you like capitals, use capitals. I'd go with AVT VIAM INVENIAM AVT FACIAM. If you want to more carefully imitate how square capitals were put together, you can separate the words with an interpunct (AVT·VIAM·INVENIAM·AVT·FACIAM) or just string them all together (AVTVIAMINVENIAMAVTFACIAM). I was just making sure you were using them because you wanted to and like the effect, and not because you think that it's 'incorrect' to use minuscule letters. If you wanted to imitate Roman graffiti or medieval manuscripts, or if you just liked how they looked, minuscule would be perfectly acceptable too.
  8. Gsedge1 New Member

  9. Gsedge1 New Member

  10. Cinefactus Censor

    • Censor
    Location:
    litore aureo
    The first is Roman Rustic which I mentioned in my sticky. In use in the first few centuries AD.
    Times New Roman is actually modelled on Roman Capitals. I would choose TNR if are after an inscription font.
    The third is modern.
  11. archer111 New Member

    Hi, I know this thread is pretty old but I thought it better to tack onto this instead of adding a new one in order to cut down on the number of threads regarding this quote.

    I'll either find a way or I'll make one.
    Version 1: Aut viam inveniam aut faciam.
    Version 2: Aut inveniam viam aut faciam.
    Version 3: Viam inveniam aut faciam.

    My questions are:
    1) I've seen that sentence written in several ways on this forum. Which version is the most correct one?
    2) Does anything change (pertaining to the use of "I") if the speaker is female? I'm told that there are times when a pronoun can be unisex but if desired, a female version can be used to emphasize the gender.

    Thanks!
    Last edited by archer111, May 12, 2013
  12. Pacifica grammaticissima

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Belgium
    Hello,

    All are correct Latin, but I recommend one of the first two, the sentence has a stronger feeling to it with the two aut... aut (= either... or), and I also think they are the most "traditional" versions. Look here in case for the (short) history of the phrase. It would make absolutely no difference whether it is said by a male or a female.
  13. Ignis Umbra Ignis Aeternus

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    USA
    Hello. The only difference between the first and second versions is the word order. The translation of the third version, however, is "I will find a way or make one." aut...aut means "either...or..."

    So, in my opinion, the first version is "correct", just because the word order looks nice to me. And as far as gender changes goes, nothing needs to be changed. The gender of the speaker in this case is irrelevant. The only time you would need to change an ending is if you were using an adjective.
  14. Adrian Civis Illustris

    • Civis Illustris
    the original is based on Seneca's Drama - Hercules Furens, Act II, Scene I, verse CCLXXV: "
    Sed non tenebit. aderit et poenas petet 275
    subitusque ad astra emerget; inveniet viam aut faciet

    therefore in my opinion (in order to retain traditional composition of Seneca) : "Inveniam Viam Aut Faciam"
    malleolus likes this.
  15. Pacifica grammaticissima

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Belgium
    I think no one knows what the "original" was. Maybe Seneca himself was inspired from another source. I don't know which one of the third or first person versions first came about.

    Anyway, as Fireshadow said, aut viam inveniam aut faciam/aut inveniam viam aut faciam is "I shall either find a way or make one" and inveniam viam aut faciam "I shall find a way or make one". It's the only important difference.
  16. archer111 New Member

    Thank you all for the quick responses!

    Out of the first two, I think I like Version 2 slightly better (Aut inveniam viam aut faciam) simply because it has "inveniam viam" (...find a way...) instead of "viam inveniam" (...way find...) and that makes more sense to a latin illiterate like me even though like you all said, the word order doesn't matter.

    Thanks again!
  17. Ignis Umbra Ignis Aeternus

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    USA
    Just wanted to make sure that you understand that the phrases "inveniam viam" and "viam inveniam" translate to exactly the same thing. As I said before, the only difference between the two is the word order.
  18. Pacifica grammaticissima

    • Civis Illustris
    Location:
    Belgium
    Word order is just much freer in Latin than in English.
  19. Aurifex Aedilis

    • Aedilis
    Location:
    England
    I like your avatar. Is it a gyr falcon, by any chance?
  20. Adrian Civis Illustris

    • Civis Illustris
    Puella, it appears to me you have not quite understood what I ment to express.

    Some books and Wikipedia alledge "Aut viam inveniam aut faciam" to Hannibal; yet provide no example or excerpt from roman hitoriographs who in their works wrote that Hannibal actually uttered such words (in such form as provided in them); therefore the only actually existing composition corresponding to it is the verse 276 of Hercules Furens

    If we have a genuine original composition corresponding to the need; it is best to leave it untouched (similar to multitude variations of well known quotes of Horace and Vergil like "fortune favours the brave/bold" etc). That is why I sustain my opinion that in this case ""Inveniam Viam Aut Faciam" being a direct and untouched modification of the original Seneca composition is the best choice. I see no point in "translation overkill" using "aut.... aut"; in desperate attempt of making a latin calque of the english version. Seneca's fragment inveniet viam aut faciet [he shall find a way or make (one)] already implicates logically that he shall either find a way or make one.

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