This is the beginning, my friends, let us celebrate with arousing ladies

By AdvocatusDiaboli, in 'English to Latin Translation', Oct 21, 2018.

  1. AdvocatusDiaboli New Member

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    "This is the beginning, my friends, let us celebrate with arousing ladies and well-hung gents in grand feasts. What? The Ivernians don't approve? So be it. Let them hate, so long as they love."

    "In Hythnia, men will wail at your feet while boys draw concealed swords from beneath their clothes. In Hythnia, what appears is precisely what is made to appear."


    ("Hoc est initium, amicos meum, nunc est celebrandum per titīllatum dominæ et domini virilis in dapes grandum. Quid? Iverniæ(Ivernii) non gustāre? Fiat. Oderint dum amorant."

    "In Hythniæ, viri ulularūm votros pedes sur et pueri ensis gladii sub sus vestarii. In Hythniæ, quid est demonstrandum esse ipsum factum.")
  2. Callaina Feles Curiosissima

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    What is this for?
  3. AdvocatusDiaboli New Member

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    A book I've written.
  4. Callaina Feles Curiosissima

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    Hoc, amici, initium est. Grandibus conviviis una iucundis* cum puellis virilissimisque dominis comissemur.

    (Dapibus is also a possibility, rather than conviviis.)

    *I've taken "arousing" in a general sense: i.e. "delightful/pleasing". If you mean specifically "sexually arousing", we'll need a different word (I'm not actually sure what term the Romans used for this).

    Quid? Non approbant Ivernii**? Ita sit. Oderint, dum ament.


    **An invented Latinization of "Ivernians".

    I'll do the rest in the next reply.
    Last edited by Callaina, Oct 22, 2018
  5. Callaina Feles Curiosissima

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    Hythniae viris ad pedes tuos ululantibus pueri celatos gladios ex vestimentis stringant. Hythniae videtur prorsus quod videri coactum est.



    Wait around for others' opinions, please (particularly on that last one).
    Last edited by Callaina, Oct 22, 2018
  6. Callaina Feles Curiosissima

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  7. Pacifica grammaticissima

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    Grandibus: this means "(very) big, huge", but I think "grand" here means something more like "magnificent". Magnificis might be a better fit.

    "Ladies" and "gents" would be better as feminis and viris, I think.

    Virilissimis could mean "very manly" in a number of ways, not necessarily to do with the size of one's genitals. What about bene mentulatis?
    I do think it's more likely to be meant as "sexually arousing". However, I'm not sure how to express that idea concisely.
    I think sit alone or esto would be more usual.
    Or vestros. We don't know. AdvocatusDiaboli, is the "In Hythnia" bit addressed to one person or several?
    Stringent.
    ... id prorsus videtur... would be clearer. It would possibly also be better to replace videtur and videri with cernitur and cerni.

    I'm on the fence about that use of the verb cogo. Is this really about forcing/compelling things to appear (as if the things were reluctant to appear in the first place), or is it rather about making things appear/causing things to appear in a more neutral way, like choosing that such or such thing should appear?
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  8. Pacifica grammaticissima

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    Actually, in that last bit, ipsum instead of prorsus could remove some ambiguity as well (because prorsus could be taken to go with the verb).
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  9. Callaina Feles Curiosissima

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    Yes, that's much better (particularly the last :D).

    I took the "your feet" to be a general sort of "you" and therefore requiring the subjunctive (I don't think "will" is meant quite as future here ("When you go to Hynthia, such-and-such will happen") but rather as a general statement ("In Hynthia, such-and-such happens to whoever is there")).

    Yeah, it's ambiguous to say the least (also, whether it means more "what things appear are exactly those things that are made to appear", or "how things appear (i.e. how events/circumstances appear in general) are exactly how they are made to appear".)
  10. Pacifica grammaticissima

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    It would require the subjunctive only if the general "you" were the subject.
    Yes, that's possible. We can't be sure without knowing the context, though. AdvocatusDiaboli should tell us more. If you're right, the present indicative is probably the best fit (or, alternatively, a construction with solere), and it might be better to remove tuos altogether.
    I guess we need some clarification from the OP here too.
  11. Callaina Feles Curiosissima

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    Why is that? Not doubting you, it just seems illogical.
  12. Pacifica grammaticissima

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    I don't know.
  13. Pacifica grammaticissima

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    To be honest, a potential subjunctive may be possible there, but somehow neither the subjunctive nor the indicative feel quite ideal with a general tuos in this sentence. If it's general, I think the most idiomatic way to put it is without a possessive (and with an indicative verb).
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  14. Pacifica grammaticissima

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    As for the "arousing ladies" in the sense of "sexually arousing", I really can't think of any equivalent Latin adjective. I'm afraid we may have to resort to a relative clause and say something like feminis quae pruriginem incitent.
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  15. Callaina Feles Curiosissima

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    Though that makes it a bit ambiguous: are the men wailing at their own feet, or someone else? :D
  16. Pacifica grammaticissima

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    I don't think it's quite possible to take it as their own feet, because what would that mean?
  17. Callaina Feles Curiosissima

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    It would be possible in English (just like, say, a baby can wail at its mother). But perhaps ad can't quite be used that way in Latin?
  18. Pacifica grammaticissima

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    Ah, you meant "wail at" in that sense! Ad can be used that way in Latin (though maybe not as commonly as in English) but it's rather unlikely with feet...
  19. Callaina Feles Curiosissima

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    Yes, not likely, but then we're describing a foreign country with strange, even bizarre customs, so...
  20. Pacifica grammaticissima

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    I think that, even under these circumstances, it's a very, very far-fetched interpretation, given how common a phrase ad pedes is with the local meaning of "at (one's) feet". Now if you must include a possessive, I suppose you can say cuiusque.

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