Cum quidam dubitent
- Thread starter COPLAND 3
- Start date
The ancient to the lady Elect. While some people doubt whether these two epistles are of the apostle John, through the fact, however, that they resemble the first one both in words and in a similar assertion of faith and charity against the heretics, they are proven to be of the apostle, not of the priest John. He writes to a certain Babylonian, who was called by her proper name Elect, advising her and her sons not to depart from the purpose of faith because of the heretics. Through this Elect the universal mother church is signified; through her sons the younger people begotten in faith by the church. He writes therefore to the universal church that there is no perfection of faith outside charity, and he execrates the heretics who divide Jesus Christ.
Pacis translation looks right to me. 'Per hoc autem' looked odd to me, and I was curious about an infinitive replacing what even in Engliſh would be the equvalent of an 'ut' clause; but that may have been to avoid a ſubjunctive ſuch as would normally be used in an 'ut' clause.
non esse fidei perfectionem extra charitatem
Ah, yes, you are right, perhaps the infinitive coming before the accuſative threw me off.
Again just reading p98 of the book
and just looking at "minores ab ecclesia geniti in fide"
younger people begotten in faith by the church??
Does this make sense? Maybe?
Could it be "younger people from the church begotten in faith"?
and just looking at "minores ab ecclesia geniti in fide"
younger people begotten in faith by the church??
Does this make sense? Maybe?
Could it be "younger people from the church begotten in faith"?
I think you are right
BUT
By the lady the church is signified and by her sons young people begotten by the church.
The glossator is getting his analogies confused.
I don't find that one too bad. I quite like John's identification of charity and good works with knowing God.
[and it even allows me to be a bit more understanding of "born of the church" if we take it as "born of God"; the problem is that 2 John (where we have the children begotten by the church) distinguishes between people who have come to the Church and those born as members of the church - and says the latter are begotten by the church, while the earlier 1 John sees all who have charity as "born of God".
I note that 2 John also has the idea of not communicating with those who do not have the doctrine. Mmm. Where else was it we came upon that?]
One thing, though: the text should probably be:
Charity is a disposition of the mind to love God for the sake of God, and ONE'S neighbor for the sake of God. Also elsewhere. [not "the neighbor"]
[and it even allows me to be a bit more understanding of "born of the church" if we take it as "born of God"; the problem is that 2 John (where we have the children begotten by the church) distinguishes between people who have come to the Church and those born as members of the church - and says the latter are begotten by the church, while the earlier 1 John sees all who have charity as "born of God".
I note that 2 John also has the idea of not communicating with those who do not have the doctrine. Mmm. Where else was it we came upon that?]
One thing, though: the text should probably be:
Charity is a disposition of the mind to love God for the sake of God, and ONE'S neighbor for the sake of God. Also elsewhere. [not "the neighbor"]
I'm not sure that is what they mean. I think that even if you come to the church and were not born physically in it, you are "begotten in faith by the church" at the moment you come to it.
I don't know, but similar things must be found elsewhere, I think... Avoidance or persecution of those who don't believe as you think is right is timeless.
Ok, if you think that's better, I'll send about it.