Est nunquam molestum lupo quot oves exsistant

prismface

New Member

the quote goes something like..



It never troubles the wolf how many the sheep may be

I can't find it anywhere in the Aeneid but I've seen this quote being ascribed to that text, is it a genuine quote, am I looking at the wrong text? Perhaps its from a different Virgil text? Any help on this would be greatly appreciated!
 
B

Bitmap

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Re: Help! I can't find a quote ascribed to Virgil's Aeneid

you won't find that quote anywhere in Vergil's works - that phrase doesn't fit into an hexametre
 

prismface

New Member

Re: Help! I can't find a quote ascribed to Virgil's Aeneid

thanks Bitmap. here's a quote from a Francis Bacon essay that spurred my curiosity- Nay, number (itself) in armies importeth not much, where the people are of weak courage; for (as Virgil saith) It never troubles a wolf, how many the sheep be.

is he paraphrasing something from Virgil or just making stuff up? :brickwall:
 

Labienus

Civis Illustris

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Re: Help! I can't find a quote ascribed to Virgil's Aeneid

My love of the Eclogues might pay off for once:

I think he might have been referring to this line from Eclogue V, spoken by Menalcas

Nec lupus insidias pecori, nec retia ceruis [60]
ulla dolum meditantur:
Which might translate roughly to:

The wolf meditates no ambush for the flock,
nor the nets any grief for the deer:

Ignoring the second clause, I think this is roughly what you're looking at. '...lupus insidias pecori... | meditantur'

It seems very similar to me, anyway. Hope it's of some help :)
 

prismface

New Member

Re: Help! I can't find a quote ascribed to Virgil's Aeneid

thankyou Labienus :mrgreen:

that must be what Bacon was referring to... what would you say is the meaning behind those lines they're quite cryptic? :wondering: (perhaps because i've not read the Eclogues :oops: )
 

Labienus

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Re: Help! I can't find a quote ascribed to Virgil's Aeneid

Well, here is some more of the context:

Candidus insuetum miratur limen Olympi
sub pedibus uidet nubes et sidera Daphnis.
Ergo alacris siluas et cetera rura uoluptas
Panaque pastoresque tenet Dryadasque puellas.
Nec lupus insidias pecori, nec retia ceruis [60]
ulla dolum meditantur: amat bonus otia Daphnis.
In Eclogue V, an Amoebaean singing competition is taking place between Mopsus and Menalcas. Menalcas is just taking his turn and opens with the above. The tone is clearly an exaltive one emphasising the celestial and heavenly qualities of Olympus (since Daphnis, the subject matter of the singing, is upon the threshold of Olympus and about to enter and become a god). The imagery is a mixture of the locus amoenus combined with heavenly grandeur and, as is customary of the locus amoenus (or indeed, most depctions of heaven itself), there is no war, strife, hardship, treachery etc..

In this context, the part you're referring to is emphasising this [paraphrasing, not translating:] 'Here you'll find no treacherous wolves planning to trap sheep! Nor nets planning to harm deer! Good Daphnis loves peace! This is heaven!'

Does that help?
 

Imber Ranae

Ranunculus Iracundus

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Re: Help! I can't find a quote ascribed to Virgil's Aeneid

That doesn't really seem to fit the sentiment, though, do you think? The only real similarity is the image of a wolf hunting herd animals, an extremely common trope in Latin literature (or any literature for that matter). It has nothing to do with the failure of a large number of weak animals to deter a predator, which is Bacon's point.

Francis Bacon was not one to just make stuff up, so it's probably to be found elsewhere among Vergil's works. I'll have a look, but I don't think it will be an easy find.
 

Imber Ranae

Ranunculus Iracundus

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Location:
Grand Rapids, Michigan
Re: Help! I can't find a quote ascribed to Virgil's Aeneid

I've found it.

Vergil dixit:
THYRSIS
Hic focus et taedae pingues, hic plurimus ignis
semper, et adsidua postes fuligine nigri;
hic tantum Boreae curamus frigora, quantum
aut numerum lupus aut torrentia flumina ripas.
Ecloga VII, 49-52
  • THYRSIS
    "Here is a hearth, and resinous logs, here fire
    Unstinted, and doors black with ceaseless smoke.
    Here heed we Boreas' icy breath as much
    As the wolf heeds the number of the flock,
    Or furious rivers their restraining banks."

As you can see, the idea is stated very tersely in a simile. From curamus you have to supply curat with lupus, and "of the flock" is merely implied with numerum.

Stated directly it would be something like: Minime [gregis/pecoris] numerum lupus curat.
 

Labienus

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Re: Help! I can't find a quote ascribed to Virgil's Aeneid

As Imber has said, it is a very common image in bucolic poetry. I should have put a bit more time into searching, prism, instead of misleading you. However, I only have a spare few minutes every day so forgive a rushed effort, if you would ;)

Good find, Imber. Maybe I should have taken taken the time to look through all of them last night instead of relying on my [rapidly fading] memory.
 
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