FRFC - Round I, Match I

Who would be victorious in Hand-to-Hand combat?

  • Lucius Catilina - the infamous conspirator

    Votes: 11 78.6%
  • Gaius Verres - the infamous misgovernor

    Votes: 3 21.4%

  • Total voters



  • Aedilis

Gaius Verres – proconsul VS Lucius Sergius Catilina (Catiline)

1. hand to hand combat, no weapons
2. no armor, cloth and sandals only
3. fighters can be thought of as being any age (within their actual lifespan of course)
4. Vote!
5. Explain your decision. :)



  • Aedilis

I will put myself out there and go first. I voted for Verres. Not coming from as noble of a family, he might have been a little bit more rough around the edges, and a better brawler. :box:



  • Aedilis

But, on the other hand, Catiline was rather crafty.... :wondering:

After all, according to Cicero, he had a 6th sense, and roamed the city at night looking for open windows and drunk husbands so that he could engage in adultery. :dancing:



  • Princeps Senatus

Catilina - I have no doubt about it. He would use whatever way possible to achieve the goal, which is nowadays commonly referred to as "fighting dirty".

Decimvs dixit:
according to Cicero, he had a 6th sense, and roamed the city at night looking for open windows and drunk husbands so that he could engage in adultery

Still, I have to admit that this sounds a little like Tacitus' description of the "terrible" Livia - changing history after the fact to suit one's needs... :silenced:


New Member

Gaius Verres.

I might have watched too many gladiator movies, but "rough around the edges" seems like a better option for a fist fight.

C Crastinus

New Member

This is quite an interesting question. :) Two of Cicero's most notorious foes squaring off. Perhaps the winner could take on Cicero's other nemesis, Publius Clodius Pulcher. Of course, if all of Cicero's archenemies were involved, I would put my money on Marcus Antonius. Anyway...on to the question at hand.

They both came from senatorial families and had a penchant for debauchery. Verres' family may not have been quite as illustrious as Catiline's, but I'm not sure that would have made him a bit rougher around the edges. Catiline's family had fallen from prominence long before his time, so the two probably would have had similar upbringings.

They both showed a readiness to inflict cruelty. Verres may have more instances of cruelty attributed to him, but his acts of cruelty were carried out by his minions in all the accounts I've read. Catiline, on the other hand, supposedly carried out murders with his own hands.

Catiline was reputed to have had a tough constitution and was capable of enduring physical hardship. I don't believe there is any evidence as to Verres' physical toughness.

They both had military experience, but while Verres' skill in hand to hand combat is unattested, we do have a record of Catiline's performance on the battlefield. Catiline's body was found far ahead of his front line. In order to have fought his way through so many opposing legionaries, he must have possessed at least above average fighting ability.

In the absence of any evidence as to Verres' fighting ability, I have to cast my vote in favor of Catiline. He may not have been able to win the consulship, but perhaps he can win this contest. :)

Iohannes Aurum

Technicus Auxiliarius

  • Technicus Auxiliarius

Decimus, a thread necromancer broke the tie.



  • Aedilis

Excellent rationale for the decision Crastinus!

Ok, I will wait another day or so and then consider this bout closed. Then, we can move on to our next match!