Grant me the power of altering the memories of others in order for them to forget certain informatio

What would be the most correct way to translate the following sentence into Latin? The portion in bold is what I was able to translate thus far.
Grant me the power of altering the memories of others in order for them to forget certain information upon completion of a specific action.
Da mihi potestatem mutandi memorias alius
 

Pacifica

grammaticissima
Staff member
Da mihi potestatem mutandi memorias aliorum ut ii certa quadam actione completa quaedam obliviscantur.
 

Callaina

Feles Curiosissima
Do we really need both certa and quadam?
 

Iáson

Cívis Illústris
Do we really need both certa and quadam?
It might be a bit neater to omit as well. It also still feels a little strange to me to use alius in that sense: I may well be wrong but it would nice to see a parallel.
 

Pacifica

grammaticissima
Staff member
Do we really need both certa and quadam?
I guess certa alone would still work, but certa quadam seems to work well too.

It's better with ii, and I don't see anything wrong with aliorum, which means straightforwardly "of others".
 

Pacifica

grammaticissima
Staff member
I suppose she added it because otherwise it might sound as though the memories are doing the forgetting.
That sort of is the reason. Even though it's an unlikely interpretation (so that even without ii one would understand that the memories aren't the subject), it seemed to me to make for smoother language with ii.
 
Thank you all for the help.
Pacifica, would you be so kind as to offer me the English translation of the following?
aliorum ut ii certa quadam actione completa quaedam obliviscantur.
 

Pacifica

grammaticissima
Staff member
Word for word:

... of others (aliorum) so that (ut) they (ii), some/a (quadam) certain/specific (certa) action (actione) having been completed (completa), may forget (obliviscantur) certain things (quaedam).
 

Callaina

Feles Curiosissima
Word for word:

... of others (aliorum) so that (ut) they (ii), some/a (quadam) certain/specific (quadam) action (actione) having been completed (completa), may forget (obliviscantur) certain things (quaedam).
You mean certa. ;)
 
Though you do not use the word Latin word for "when" in your translation could one add that word in the English translation like the following?
Grant me the power of altering the memories of others so that they may forget certain things when a certain action has been completed.
 

Pacifica

grammaticissima
Staff member
Yes, you can; or your original "upon completion of a specific action" is good too.
 

Callaina

Feles Curiosissima
Though you do not use the word Latin word for "when" in your translation could one add that word in the English translation like the following?
Grant me the power of altering the memories of others so that they may forget certain things when a certain action has been completed.
Yes, it's implied in the construction she used; Latin doesn't necessarily need to state "when" specifically.
 

Iáson

Cívis Illústris
I don't see anything wrong with aliorum, which means straightforwardly "of others".

I suppose it's just that I'm used to seeing alius used with some sort of contrast, where the author mentions one thing and then uses alius to mark out a different group - 'some people read books, but others prefer computers'. Here 'of others' means just 'people other than myself'. This sense would be conveyed adequately by something like alicuius.

If the context of the sentence was something like, 'O great Hecate, I know that the Romans are favoured by the gods, and I do not ask for powers to affect them. But grant me the power of altering the memories of others, in order for them to forget certain information upon completion of a specific action.' I would feel a bit more confortable with aliórum.

I suppose arguably it might be important to emphasise that this power affects other people and can't be used on the self, and maybe alius would be justified on those grounds - I just can't really think of a parallel for such a use without something like praeter mé. But it may be that the idiom carries across perfectly well.

Sorry, this is all just a minor quibble - I apologise for stirring up all this fuss over it!
 

Pacifica

grammaticissima
Staff member
I don't think it needs to have the sort of emphasis/contrast that you say. I.e. I think it can just mean "some other people" without there necessarily being a strong dichotomy between X and others.

But I suppose we could say hominum and it wouldn't change so much the meaning of the original.
 
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