Translation training — Pro Sex. Roscio 4

[Pacifica]

As usual, votes (don't be afraid to vote, it's free and anonymous ) and comments welcome.

Quae res ea est? Bona patris huiusce Sex. Rosci, quae sunt sexagiens, quae de viro fortissimo et clarissimo L. Sulla, quem honoris causa nomino, duobus milibus nummum sese dicit emisse adulescens vel potentissimus hoc tempore nostrae civitatis, L. Cornelius Chrysogonus. Is a vobis, iudices, hoc postulat, ut, quoniam in alienam pecuniam tam plenam atque praeclaram nullo iure invaserit, quoniamque ei pecuniae vita Sex. Rosci obstare atque officere videatur, deleatis ex animo suo suspicionem omnem metumque tollatis; sese hoc incolumi non arbitratur huius innocentis patrimonium tam amplum et copiosum posse obtinere, damnato et eiecto sperat se posse, quod adeptus est per scelus, id per luxuriam effundere atque consumere. Hunc sibi ex animo scrupulum, qui se dies noctesque stimulat ac pungit, ut evellatis, postulat, ut ad hanc suam praedam tam nefariam adiutores vos profiteamini.

What is it? The possessions of the father of this same Sex. Roscius, worth 6,000,000 sesterces, which he who is definitely the most powerful young man in our state these days, L. Cornelius Chrysogonus, says he bought from the bravest and most distinguished man L. Sulla, whom I name out of respect, for two thousand sesterces. Since this Chrysogonus, gentlemen, has quite illegitimately laid hands on so full and grand a fortune which belonged to another, and since the life of Sex. Roscius seems to be a hindrance and impediment to his possession of that fortune, Chrysogonus is asking you to put an end to all the mistrust in his heart and to remove all fear from from it: as long as Sex. Roscius is safe and sound, Chrysogonus does not think he can retain possession of the property, so large and copious, of this innocent man; but if the latter is condemned and expelled, he is hoping he can expend and squander through extravagance that which he has acquired through villainy. He is asking you to tear out of his heart this worry which pricks and stings him day and night, so that you should declare yourselves his accomplices in this so foul spoliation perpetrated by him.

 

[Pacifica]

Absolutely no opinion...? I know it's rather long; you don't necessarily have to analyze it in detail or take pains to write a long post, but it will already help me a bit if you quickly read it and vote according to your general impression.

 

[Callaina]

Just a few things that jumped out at me:

- "which he who is definitely the most powerful young man in our state these days" -> this feels clunky, and the antecedent of "which" isn't clear.
- "this so foul spoliation" -> in general, "this so" + adjective isn't idiomatic in English as it is in Latin.
- "since the life of Sex. Roscius seems to be a hindrance and impediment to his possession of that fortune," -> wouldn't "seems to him" be better?

I'll have a look in more detail later.

 

[Imperfacundus]

In archaic style, 'this so foul a spoliation' would fly, I think.

 

[Imperfacundus]

The whole second sentence is a bit chaotic in English, and could use a rearrangement like:

They are this Sex. Roscius' father's six-million-sesterces'-worth properties, which L. Cornelius Chrysogonus, who is clearly the country's most powerful young man these days, says he bought for two thousand sesterces from the most brave and distinguished L. Sulla, whom I name out of respect.

 

[Pacifica]

the antecedent of "which" isn't clear.

What could it possibly be but the "possessions"?

- "this so foul spoliation" -> in general, "this so" + adjective isn't idiomatic in English as it is in Latin.
- "since the life of Sex. Roscius seems to be a hindrance and impediment to his possession of that fortune," -> wouldn't "seems to him" be better?

I'll have a look in more detail later.

In archaic style, 'this so foul a spoliation' would fly, I think.

Ok, thanks.

The whole second sentence is a bit chaotic in English, and could use a rearrangement like:

Thanks again. But doesn't it have to be "six-million-sesterce-worth"? I thought you didn't mark plural forms in such compounds (i.e. in the same way as you say "a six-year-old child" and not "a six-years-old child").

 

[Imperfacundus]

Oh there was supposed to be an 'of' before 'properties'. The thing is a noun, not an adjective.

 

[Pacifica]

Ah. So if it were an adjective, it would indeed have to be "six-million-sesterce-worth properties"?

 

[Imperfacundus]

Without the 'worth', but yes.

 

[Callaina]

What could it possibly be but the "possessions"?

Given the placement, I keep wanting to read it with the six million sesterces.

 

[Pacifica]

Given the placement, I keep wanting to read it with the six million sesterces.

Six million sesterces being bought isn't a very likely situation, lol, whereas buying possessions is more so, so I thought it would be clear enough. But I see what you mean; since the info about buying comes later, the reader thinks, for a certain time, that it goes with the six million sesterces, and even if it's made clear later on that it isn't that, it makes for bad style, I suppose.

 

[Imperfacundus]

whom I name out of respect, for two thousand sesterces.

 

[Pacifica]

Well, it seems to me it's unlikely that anyone would really interpret it like that. Logic exists and people can use it a little, right?

 

[Imperfacundus]

I know, I just found it funny picturing Cicero reluctantly taking a bribe to stroke Sulla's ego.

 

[Callaina]

the bravest and most distinguished
so full and grand
a hindrance and impediment
put an end to all the mistrust in his heart and to remove all fear from from it
so large and copious
condemned and expelled
expend and squander
pricks and stings

Admittedly Cicero does seem rather fond of such (near) synonym pairs, but I really wonder whether they should all be translated (somehow this technique seems to work better in Latin than English, at least to my mind). This paragraph in particular, I think, runs the risk of becoming a sort of self-parody if they are.

 

[Callaina]

I know, I just found it funny picturing Cicero reluctantly taking a bribe to stroke Sulla's ego.

LOL

 

[Callaina]

And then there's "safe and sound", which isn't even in the original Latin

 

[Pacifica]

I know, I just found it funny picturing Cicero reluctantly taking a bribe to stroke Sulla's ego.

Lol.

Admittedly Cicero does seem rather fond of such (near) synonym pairs, but I really wonder whether they should all be translated (somehow this technique seems to work better in Latin than English, at least to my mind). This paragraph in particular, I think, runs the risk of becoming a sort of self-parody if they are.

Well, yes, I did notice there are a couple of pleonasms there... Now I thought that, well, if the original was pleonastic, why should the translation not be...

 

[Pacifica]

And then there's "safe and sound", which isn't even in the original Latin

But "safe and sound" is the usual English idiom, isn't it?

 

[Callaina]

But "safe and sound" is the usual English idiom, isn't it?

It is, but given the huge number of pleonasms already in the paragraph, maybe it's best to avoid it here and just use "safe".