What are you watching?
- Thread starter Pacifica
- Start date
Hawkwood
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If he's a member of National Action as you state then surely there is information out there on him directly linking him as a member.
All I've found is a paragraph from that dishonestly marxist doxing group Hope Not Hate suggesting it appeared to show him at a Free Speech rally along with other speakers like Anne Marie Walters.
Where is the source of his membership you stated because I can't find it?
All I've found is a paragraph from that dishonestly marxist doxing group Hope Not Hate suggesting it appeared to show him at a Free Speech rally along with other speakers like Anne Marie Walters.
Where is the source of his membership you stated because I can't find it?
Bitmap
Civis Illustris
On his affiliation, you find this article by hopenothate.org.uk:
Inside Generation Identity UK: International Identitarian Report
Ben van der Merwe was inside GI UK. He attended their yearly conference and passed HOPE not hate thousands of internal messages and planning documents.
www.hopenothate.org.uk
Or if you want the short version of it, here is the story as a compilation of twitter posts:
If you go through the twitter messages by Rowsell, you find a few strongly nativist messages:
And also some things that seem to be some kind of "code" ... like what in the world is "based", as in "based Anglo woman", "based Swede", "based Netherlands" etc.?
Hawkwood
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1. I'm not arsed about Hope Not Hate's piece or their tweeter's claims below as I know what they are and their tactics of misinformation and their doxing history. He might have attended a free speech rally but that does not make him a member of the outlawed National Action as CLAIMED by Etaoin nor do I see anything alluding to Generation Identity membership as CLAIMED by Etaoin. Nor do I see an AFFILIATION to anything other than himself attending a rally.
2. This tweeted footage from him does not show any signs of racism either other than to show him at the rally in question.
3. One of those two tweets alludes to xenophobia or at least a reluctance to not want more ugly houses and foreigners and on that basis, although I have no issues with him holding a personal opinion on immigration or architecture, I will apologize and remove the PIE video.
2. This tweeted footage from him does not show any signs of racism either other than to show him at the rally in question.
3. One of those two tweets alludes to xenophobia or at least a reluctance to not want more ugly houses and foreigners and on that basis, although I have no issues with him holding a personal opinion on immigration or architecture, I will apologize and remove the PIE video.
So we got to the nitty gritty of this and it would seem other than one tweet signifying an anti-immigrational mindset (perhaps there are a few more) there is no evidence of him being a member of either National Action or Generation Identity.
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Hawkwood
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Why not just say he's tweeted a few things on mass-immigration, Etaion instead of stating a membership to the banned group National Action as well as Generation Identity, which I think is a counter jihad movement of right wingers like Walters and Murray?
If you really read it somewhere then link it.
If you really read it somewhere then link it.
Hawkwood
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I mean
Well she's not going to defend her statement so on his affiliation, @Bitmap, what do you mean? Affiliation to that specific Free Speech rally or to Generation Identity and/or National Action?On his affiliation, you find this article by hopenothate.org.uk:
Inside Generation Identity UK: International Identitarian Report
Ben van der Merwe was inside GI UK. He attended their yearly conference and passed HOPE not hate thousands of internal messages and planning documents.
Hawkwood
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I mean words are important right, the truth stands for something.
I've spent the day arguing and defending a bloody PIE video over a statement made by Latin D's Thought Police branch that to my mind is wholly false as I can't find a shred of evidence relating to an affiliation let alone a membership to an outlawed group. I'm just supposed to take her word for it.
Yes a few of his tweets are shit but come on, where is the integrity in her initial statement and if it's true or at least Etaoin thought it to be true then where is her evidence for it?
I've spent the day arguing and defending a bloody PIE video over a statement made by Latin D's Thought Police branch that to my mind is wholly false as I can't find a shred of evidence relating to an affiliation let alone a membership to an outlawed group. I'm just supposed to take her word for it.
Yes a few of his tweets are shit but come on, where is the integrity in her initial statement and if it's true or at least Etaoin thought it to be true then where is her evidence for it?
Bitmap
Civis Illustris
Those organisations don't exactly publish their member lists on some internet website for everyone to download. Unless somebody openly confesses to his affiliation, you're mostly left speculating.
What I gave you were the results I obtained from entering his name on google and spending 5-10 minutes reading a few things. He spoke at an event that even the continental Identitarians disapproved of, he wanted his presence to be hidden, he brought friends who are reportedly ex-National Action and he doesn't exactly hide his opinions that coincide with some typical Identitarian points.
Make of that what you want. I have no hard feelings on that guy. I don't know him and I don't care about him much.
Now I'm not entirely sure why you would do that. As I said, the guy may have a dodgy background, but the video itself is rather innocuous and doesn't contain any political points ... or if it does, they must be too subtle for me to spot.
Hawkwood
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So you're speculating on affiliation? Ok well that needs to be expressed as there is a marked difference between speculation and evidence.
Well can you blame him? There are plenty of moderates and conservatives who attend Free Speech rallies but don't want their career and name killed because of it.
Ex National Action, you realize they are a terrorist group? Where is the proof for this? Do you know what Hope Not Hate are, the writers of that piece? I suggest you take EVERYTHING they say with a pinch of salt or at least cross reference with a more legitimate source.
Neither do I care. I've ended up defending him when all I wanted to do was nip today's exchange in the bud.
Because once I then decided to entertain her third or fourth attempt at that false statement (below)
[cont]..at the halfway stage of exchange I then decided to apologize and remove video if he was indeed found to be a white supremacist or a member of National Action. Granted he's not a white supremacist to my mind nor a member of National Action or GI but his tweet on mass-immigration was souring to me even though I have no issues with him having that opinion and on the whole thought it best to remove the video.
@Etaoin Shrdlu you're either lying or you read something that was incorrect. Time to show some integrity and link what you read that made you state on numerous times in this exchange that he was a member of a terrorist group. You can't rely on Bitmap as he doesn't have this alleged information that you have.
Bitmap
Civis Illustris
As I might have mentioned above, I don't care too much about that guy. I got a vague idea about the circles he moves in and the ideas he shares on twitter. It's irrelevant to me whether he pays his monthly membership fees given that all I had to say about him was that he seems to have a dodgy background.
Hawkwood
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Yes but surely it's important if he is or isn't a member as they're in jail for terrorism. If it's a vague idea then it's at best a suspected affiliation based on his views in two tweets, and even at that it's a giant push of a connection. People are losing their careers and being destroyed over speculation today and they're mostly conservatives, I know you don't need me to tell you this.
Tbh I find it surprising as you're normally quite careful on the whole but ok, fair enough.
Hawkwood
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Source.
Source.
Source.
This? Source.
Source.
Source.
Source.
Incorrect, still awaiting source.
You owe your statement a source if you want to be taken seriously else it's merely a groundless accusation and empty assertion, which in turn raises questions on your integrity.
Hawkwood
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I can't find a single other tweet in line with those two posted (but I am not the best at searching). I did see the based terminology tweet but it just means not caring what others think of you, it's internet slang according to google so hopefully we can now rule out that as codewords to white supremacy and or as evidence of membership to banned groups and terrorist organizations.
In fact it appears he tweets a lot of tongue-in-cheek stuff that borders on trollish and I certainly won't hang him for that. Maybe those two tweets were a piss take as he does seem to do a lot of it, maybe he is dead set against immigration or maybe he's a white supremacist, I can't say based on that.
And that piece by Hope Not Hate is likely a stitch up job because that's what Nick Lowles' doxing crew has done to countless others in the past so without cross-referencing their marxist propaganda website with at least one reputable source other than their twitter minions, you're on shakey ground. Even Hope Not Hate did not accuse him of being a member of either group, and that's saying something, so where has it come from?
Now I realize you're not arsed @Bitmap but it has been somewhat interesting for me to scratch at the surface of this today and peer at the substance behind claims to his membership of terrorist groups, the speculation at codewords and suspected affiliations and of course the only actual substance which you rightly found and which I based my decision to delete on; one of those two tweets.
And I don't think @Etaoin Shrdlu can show her link wherein she read this information on membership because, well...who knows why eh.
So that is that unless someone else can come to her aid and show me a source that actually supports her accusation. And I don't mind being wrong.
In fact it appears he tweets a lot of tongue-in-cheek stuff that borders on trollish and I certainly won't hang him for that. Maybe those two tweets were a piss take as he does seem to do a lot of it, maybe he is dead set against immigration or maybe he's a white supremacist, I can't say based on that.
And that piece by Hope Not Hate is likely a stitch up job because that's what Nick Lowles' doxing crew has done to countless others in the past so without cross-referencing their marxist propaganda website with at least one reputable source other than their twitter minions, you're on shakey ground. Even Hope Not Hate did not accuse him of being a member of either group, and that's saying something, so where has it come from?
Now I realize you're not arsed @Bitmap but it has been somewhat interesting for me to scratch at the surface of this today and peer at the substance behind claims to his membership of terrorist groups, the speculation at codewords and suspected affiliations and of course the only actual substance which you rightly found and which I based my decision to delete on; one of those two tweets.
And I don't think @Etaoin Shrdlu can show her link wherein she read this information on membership because, well...who knows why eh.
So that is that unless someone else can come to her aid and show me a source that actually supports her accusation. And I don't mind being wrong.
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Etaoin Shrdlu
Civis Illustris
Wow. Just wow.
Hawkwood
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By all means be flabbergasted at my decision to call your bluff and go from telling you to pee off to entertaining your empty accusation but I'd sooner you put up your source if you're to be taken seriously.
Quite simple, if you make an accusation then you're supposed to give evidence to support it, not slither off in the vain hope others will find something for you.
Etaoin Shrdlu
Civis Illustris
I'm more flabbergasted by your willingness to humiliate yourself, at tedious length. You have absolutely no idea how mad these obsessive, often consecutive, posts make you look.