A different kettle of fish / Another story

Anbrutal Russicus

Active Member
Hai, so the context is somebody interjects an example of what they think you're talking about, but it's not what you had in mind, so you say "no, this is a whole different kettle of fish" to mean "you're thinking in the wrong direction" or "your example is too far afield"; or you might use the same expressions to stop yourself from going on a tangent. Note that the two En. expressions aren't fully equivalent - one is about a different thing, another states that the issue would require a detailed exposition in order to be understood properly. I'm rather after the former if I had to choose. The 'kettle' one (+ 'ball game' in the US) can also be used to stress that a certain conclusion shouldn't be drawn from or justified by a given premise - I'm not looking to express this exact meaning, though I'm still interested if you have a suitable expression.

The closest starting point I have is ex illā/eādem officīnā which is roughly equivalent to illud genus, eijusdem orīginis. This would suggest ex aliā/dīversā officīnā, but this isn't found in either the classical corpus or in Google in general. There's also the expression eijusdem farīnae, but it seems to refer to quality (esp. of character) via the 'material it's made of' metaphor. If you can come up with a neologistic expression based on some modern Romance (or even otherwise) variety, I'm open for that as well.
 
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LCF

One of "those" people
is alia res not sufficient?
 

LCF

One of "those" people
In Russian there are a few expression like:

"ягода с другого поля"
"огурец с другого огорода"
etc..

What makes you think that "ex eadem officina" is related to this metaphor? I've looked at some translations of that line from Cicero and I am not sure it has the same sense. They translate it as "form the same workshop/studio". Maybe it's literal.
 

scrabulista

Consul
Staff member
"horse of another color" came to mind. (English)
Which took me to: harina de otro costal = "flour of another sack." (Spanish)
un altro paio di maniche ="another pair of sleeves" (Italian).

 

Cornicula

New Member
Perhaps of interest:
C8BC1D30-9945-42AD-A1D5-CA7014E3AEE4.jpeg

C602FC24-E2B0-48BD-BC92-321B1B0F4B75.jpeg

Also, search the corpus for "a proposito" for expressions like "declinatio a proposito, a proposito egredi, aberrare, etc."

Also:
"Extra calcem. lxxiii

Idem libro XXI : Ne igitur extra calcem, quod dicitur, sermo decurrens lecturo fastidium ferat, ad explicanda prospecta revertamur. Quanquam arbitror scripturam vitiatam, legendum autem esse extra callem pro extra viam, quod alibi nobis dictum est, ubi quis digreditur a re proposita." ~Erasmus, Adagia
Ammianus Marcellinus, Res gestae, 21, 1, 14; 24 (auctor c.330–c.391)
Ne igitur extra calcem (quod dicitur) sermo decurrens, lecturo fastidium ferat, ad explicanda prospecta revertamur.
Ammianus Marcellinus, Res gestae, 25, 10, 7; 12 (auctor c.330–c.391)
Et tamquam in alto gentis silentio, extra calcem (ut dicitur) procurrebat, et intempestive, parum etiam tum firmatis omnibus, ex actuario ratiociniis scrutandis incubuit, qui fraudum conscius et noxarum, ad militaria signa confugit, finxitque Iuliano superstite in res novas quendam medium surrexisse, cuius fallaciis turbo militaris acerrime concitus, Lucillianum et Seniauchum occidit.
 

LCF

One of "those" people
I was gonna suggest nihil ad rem as well which has a very close sense. Some of those expressions are cool. Like extra oleas but mean different things. Quam in tragoedia comici might be very close.
 

Anbrutal Russicus

Active Member
@Cornicula Senks yuo! :3 Yet again I forgot that this website contained all those useful indices to Erasmus' Adagia and instead was ruffling through my indexless PDF. extrā calcem is also useful and seems to be in the company of quite a few other racing-related expressions. There's another section that has quite a few relevant phrases: DISSIMILITUDINIS ET INCONGRUENTIAE.

So far to express "that's not what I'm talking about" Ego tibi dē alliīs loquor, tū respondēs de caepīs seems the most fitting - tough I'd put it as ego tibi dē alliīs, tū mihi dē caepīs. Compare Ru. я про Фому, он про Ерёму "I [am talking about] Tom and he [starts talking] about Jerry" (no relation to the cartoon :)). What I'd really like to find though is a direct opposite of the expressions in the AD REM PERTINENTIA section. Most of what I see either asserts an error too categorically and unceremoniously, or is too stand-alone proverbial.

The most suitable expressions for deflecting from the subject so far have been the racing-related ones; but these fit the "movement beyond the goal or confines" metaphor, while I'd like to find something that fits the metaphor "an object that doesn't belong together with a given category".
 

LCF

One of "those" people
"That's another story" could be a candidate with fabula.
"It's a different case" could be as well. I think they liked metaphors from the legal domain.
 

Callaina

Feles Curiosissima
Perhaps of interest:
View attachment 15650
View attachment 15651
Also, search the corpus for "a proposito" for expressions like "declinatio a proposito, a proposito egredi, aberrare, etc."

Also:
"Extra calcem. lxxiii

Idem libro XXI : Ne igitur extra calcem, quod dicitur, sermo decurrens lecturo fastidium ferat, ad explicanda prospecta revertamur. Quanquam arbitror scripturam vitiatam, legendum autem esse extra callem pro extra viam, quod alibi nobis dictum est, ubi quis digreditur a re proposita." ~Erasmus, Adagia
Ammianus Marcellinus, Res gestae, 21, 1, 14; 24 (auctor c.330–c.391)
Ne igitur extra calcem (quod dicitur) sermo decurrens, lecturo fastidium ferat, ad explicanda prospecta revertamur.
Ammianus Marcellinus, Res gestae, 25, 10, 7; 12 (auctor c.330–c.391)
Et tamquam in alto gentis silentio, extra calcem (ut dicitur) procurrebat, et intempestive, parum etiam tum firmatis omnibus, ex actuario ratiociniis scrutandis incubuit, qui fraudum conscius et noxarum, ad militaria signa confugit, finxitque Iuliano superstite in res novas quendam medium surrexisse, cuius fallaciis turbo militaris acerrime concitus, Lucillianum et Seniauchum occidit.
@Cornicula , what book are these pages from?
 
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