Attic Greek

[Paulus47]

Could anyone provide a translation for the following please?

τί οὖν ποτε λέγει ὁ θεὸς φάσκων ἑμὲ σοφώτατον εἶναι;

 

[Aurifex]

"What then does the god mean saying that I am the wisest (of men)?"

 

[Paulus47]

Hi Aurifex, thanks for the reply. Could you how the "mean saying" construction comes together?

 

[Paulus47]

"What then does the god mean saying that I am the wisest (of men)?"

Hi Aurifex, does λέγειν have the meaning "to mean" as well as "to say, to tell"?

 

[Oups]

λέγω(B),
[...]
III. say, speak, first in Hes.Th.27 (v. supr.11.2): fut. “λέξω” Emp.38.1, [...]
9. wish to say, mean, “οὔτοι γυναῖκας ἀλλὰ Γοργόνας λέγω” A.Eu.48; τί τοῦτο λέγει, πρὸ Πύλοιο; what does “πρὸ Πύλοιο” mean? Ar.Eq.1059, cf. 1021, 1375, Ec.989, Pl. Phd.60e: freq. in Platonic dialogue, πῶς λέγεις; how do you mean? in what sense do you say this? Ap.24e, al.; ἢ πῶς λέγομεν; or what do we mean to say? Grg.480b;

Liddle and Scott

 

[Paulus47]

thanks Oups, I need to buy a dictionary.

 

[Oups]

http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/resolveform?redirect=true

 

[Paulus47]

How about this:

οὖτος μὲν οἴταί τι εἰδέναι οὐκ εἰδώς, ἐγὼ δέ, ὥσπερ οὖν οὐκ οἶδα, οὐδὲ οἴομαι.

I have:

He thinks that he knows something that he doesn't (know), yet I don't even think just as I don't know.


The translation doesn't sound right and there may be a grammatical misunderstanding or two, I would value some opinions.

 

[Oups]

He thinks he knows something when he does not, whereas I, as I do not know anything, do not think (I know).

 

[Paulus47]

He thinks he knows something when he does not, whereas I, as I do not know anything, do not think (I know).

Very nice Oups. Please forgive me for burdening you with a load of questions, I am taking advantage of your good will, but do hope to put some effort back into this forum one day when fit to do so:

* In the first clause, the participle construction with verbs of knowing can regularly translate to "when" as well as "that"?
* Are there other common translations aside from "when" and "that"?
* ὥσπερ translates directly to "as"?
* How do you read the word "anything" into this translation?
* So οὐδὲ regularly translates as simple "not" as opposed to "not even"?
* How do you infer the meaning "do not think (I know)" from something that reads "do not think", if you could explain the clues that lead to this translation that would be amazing?
* Where does the word οὖν appear in your translation?

 

[Oups]

in Apology, Plato relates that:[3]

[…] οὖτος μὲν οἴεταί τι εἰδέναι οὐκ εἰδώς, ἐγὼ δέ, ὥσπερ οὖν οὐκ οἶδα, οὐδὲ οἴμαι
– This man, on one hand, believes that he knows something, while not knowing [anything]. On the other hand, I – equally ignorant – do not believe [that I know anything].​

The impreciseness of the paraphrase of this as I know that I know nothing stems from the fact that the author is not saying that he does not know anything but means instead that one cannot know anything with absolute certainty but can feel confident about certain things

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_know_that_I_know_nothing

 

[Paulus47]

Oups, thank you so much, I didn't realise that the text book I am using was quoting Plato on the Socratic paradox, I thought it was just an exercise and the author was being particularly awkward.

Just goes to show, I really do know nothing